TL;DR
Michelle went from B2B SaaS marketer to freelance copywriter and marketing coach.
She knows the importance of authentic networking, the time it takes to build client relationships, and the need for empathy in marketing.
That’s why we talked about:
- misconceptions of success in the online space
- the challenges of personal health in business
- the significance of rest periods in entrepreneurship
- awareness and problem-solving in personal growth
- redefining success on your own terms
- corporate burnout
- the power of community in supporting solopreneurs
And, of course, we share our tips for simplifying marketing:
- how to systematize content creation while maintaining a sense of personal expression
- authenticity in marketing
- creative expression in content creation
- the significance of personal connections in marketing strategies
- collaboration among creatives
- the power of effective headlines in marketing
- simplifying tools for productivity
We’re really emphasizing experimentation in finding your voice and the need to let go of societal expectations surrounding success.
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Transcript
Chapters:
00:00 | Introduction to Michelle's Journey 03:34 | The Power of Authentic Networking 06:28 | Understanding the Time Factor in Client Relationships 08:29 | Reframing Marketing Strategies 10:32 | The Illusion of Success in Online Spaces 12:29 | Navigating Personal Challenges in Business 14:40 | The Shift Towards Empathy in Marketing 16:34 | Debunking Financial Myths in Entrepreneurship 18:27 | The Importance of Rest Periods in Business 20:28 | Awareness and Problem Solving in Personal Growth 27:36 | Navigating Burnout and Expectations 30:00 | Creative Expression and Content Creation 32:30 | The Art of Systematizing Content 35:30 | Finding Your Voice and Authenticity 38:59 | The Power of Personal Connection in Marketing 43:04 | Redefining Marketing Strategies 47:53 | The Importance of Community and Collaboration 50:16 | Networking and Collaboration in Creative Spaces 54:04 | Shifting Perspectives on Learning and Growth 57:00 | The Importance of Critical Thinking and Decision Making 01:01:35 | Creating Accountability and Structure in Coaching 01:05:59 | Simplifying Tools for Productivity 01:10:35 | Redefining Success and Letting Go of Expectations
Rachel Meltzer (00:01.656) Okay, cool. Okay, so why don't you start by just introducing yourself, who you are, what you do, and what you like to do for adventure, if anything.
Michelle (00:14.206) Okay, you'll have to remind me, but hi everyone, I'm Michelle. I used to be a B2B SaaS marketer for around eight years. And now I'm actually a freelance copywriter for B2B SaaS companies, mainly in the health and wellness space and also a marketing coach for other heart-led solopreneurs, as I like to call them. And I would say for adventure, I haven't gone on adventure in a while, but I used to like going hiking. But like the low-
Rachel Meltzer (00:16.216) Okay.
Michelle (00:43.634) I feel like when I say that my friends would be like, you don't really hike. But it's like going on trails. I don't do like the six hour hike. That's not for me. I do like nature.
Rachel Meltzer (00:46.691) Hahaha
Rachel Meltzer (00:51.576) Yeah. But you do a lot of, you do a lot of traveling too.
Michelle (00:56.798) Yeah, I do want to do more because like a couple years ago I was in Japan and that was for a wedding and I was also well I think I've been traveling for weddings like I was in Japan and I was in Cabo in Mexico. I want to go to Japan next year though. It'll be so nice because I just love I love Asian food. Well, I also love Japanese food. Yeah.
Rachel Meltzer (01:10.54) Yeah, yeah.
Rachel Meltzer (01:19.3) Same, same, yeah. Okay, let's talk about, you spent eight years doing B2B marketing. How did you get into that and why did you leave?
Michelle (01:32.072) How did I get into that? I would say in, actually in university, I just studied the, I don't know what the States is like, because I'm in Canada, but for us, when I study like management and marketing in university, was more, it's more so prepping you to go into things like PNG, Unilever, like the traditional CPG companies, brand management stuff. But then, I don't know, somehow in me, I was like more of a digital, are we the digital native generation? But like, I was like,
Rachel Meltzer (01:53.338) Mm-hmm.
Rachel Meltzer (02:00.974) think so. Yeah.
Michelle (02:02.108) I like to figure things out, so guess self-taught digital marketing. then, so when I left, when I graduated from university, I was like, okay, let me find more of like a digital marketing role. And then it's through, to be honest, in my whole career, I never really officially throw resumes. It's through like coffee chats and just talking to people or like referrals. And that's how I built it, built it all up. So I feel like in human design, I'm like a four one.
Rachel Meltzer (02:26.426) Mm-hmm.
Michelle (02:32.252) And so it makes so much more sense now, like my opportunities in general, even like freelance clients or like coaching clients, it's all like through people, like it's people I know. this is why even as a marketer, I'm just like, this mostly on social does not work for me. you know, I just need. Yeah.
Rachel Meltzer (02:50.554) I think for you, I mean, the more I talk to you, the more I realize like you are such a community person. And that's why you love things like Flow Club or coffee chats or in-person things, because you are able to like make a genuine connection with a single person or a few people. And then they connect you with people and you all.
Michelle (03:03.388) Yeah.
Rachel Meltzer (03:15.128) I mean, that's what networking is at the end of the day, but I think a lot of us think of networking as this like stiff, like business focused thing that we do. But I feel like you look at networking as like a holistic, like, how can we help each other? How can we support each other? Hey, do you want to talk about this thing? Hey, can we solve each other's problems? And it doesn't have to always be a business exchange.
Michelle (03:16.318) Mm-hmm.
Michelle (03:34.644) my gosh, know, Kristen, you talk to Kristen. Hi Kristen. But she literally was like, you need to do a workshop or a master class on authentic networking. I was like, what the heck is that? was just like, your connection vibes and your networking, it doesn't even feel like you're just literally just talking to someone and you're making a new friend. I was like, isn't that what it's all about? Like, and then there's calls where people are just like so.
Rachel Meltzer (03:37.87) Yeah, yeah.
Rachel Meltzer (03:45.497) Yeah.
Rachel Meltzer (03:54.606) Yeah, you're just making friends. Yeah!
Michelle (04:02.672) amazed that sometimes like, I can connect you with this person and it's just we just met but I'm just that person right because I'm not like, I connect a racial with this one person so then she can do this for me. I'm just like, I cannot do that. It's not innate in me. So maybe this is another sign. It's like I should do that workshop.
Rachel Meltzer (04:16.098) Yeah.
Rachel Meltzer (04:22.01) I think it's important, I wonder too, I know you're not like doing coffee chats strategically, but I wonder if there's a numbers game in it where just like how I'm like sending connection requests and follow up messages on LinkedIn, it's a numbers game. How I end up getting clients out of it. Like how many coffee chats are you doing that at a time, like in a month or something? And then what does that look like a few months later as far as like your client load, you know?
Michelle (04:50.6) That's so interesting. guess I never, maybe I should go back and calculate that, but.
Rachel Meltzer (04:55.616) I wonder, because you have it in your calendar, right?
Michelle (04:59.236) Yeah, because for example, Kristen, right? She actually recently introduced a new client. It was a one-off. The client needs to do her own thing first. But I know Kristen through Flow Club. And I know Kristen three years ago-ish. So it's like, how the heck would I know? Just like me wanting to get to know someone because they're cool on Flow Club would turn into, hey, I have a bunch of friends and one of them probably is a good fit. And I was just like, OK, cool.
Rachel Meltzer (05:02.33) Mm-hmm.
Rachel Meltzer (05:09.402) Mm.
Yeah.
Rachel Meltzer (05:21.38) Mm-hmm.
Rachel Meltzer (05:25.913) Yeah.
Michelle (05:28.414) And then I was literally telling that same person, I was like, this is kind of how maybe how we should rethink marketing because it's like she was trying to tell me about a funnel and I was helping her with some like copywriting stuff. And I was just like, but what if we don't need to do all of that? I think that's also my sales side because I used to do account based marketing in B2B SaaS. And that's very like a targeted marketing programs where like a small list of target companies like
Rachel Meltzer (05:36.015) Mm.
Rachel Meltzer (05:45.027) Yeah.
Rachel Meltzer (05:49.23) Mm-hmm.
Michelle (05:58.364) that we're going after. And so working with sales, my mentality got to a point where it's like, how do we do a lot of high quality touch points, but like not like 20 steps, right? Because a lot of people that online are teaching you like, you got to have a big funnel, like get people in and then they go down and I'm just like, that's already like 20 steps. But like I literally, well, I guess I nurtured my relationship with Kristin and then that took three years.
Rachel Meltzer (06:06.426) Mm.